Episode Transcript
[00:00:08] Speaker A: You're listening to the Brand Alchemy Podcast with your hosts Jared Ascher and Jarrod Brake, where we uncover the stories and truths of real entrepreneurs and their journeys of growth and brand transformation. For more information, go to www.timelesscreative.com.
[00:00:29] Speaker B: Hey everyone. How are you all? Hey. Great to have you back. Welcome to the Brand Output podcast where we uncover the stories of entrepreneurs who transformed their visions into reality. I'm Jared Asher Herring, the host, joined by my co host, Jared Brake.
[00:00:45] Speaker C: Hey everyone, Jared here.
[00:00:46] Speaker D: Great to have you.
[00:00:47] Speaker B: On another episode each week we share the breakthrough moments, hard won victories and strategic insights that turned ambitious founders into market leaders. According to Ahrefs, the leading search data center in the world, approximately 90% of all web pages get zero organic traffic from Google, which makes them essentially invisible online. So what that means is they're sabotaging themselves without even realizing it. This is poor SEO, unclear messaging and brand communication, which means that competitors are stealing all the attention from you. This is where Jared and I come in. We are brand marketing architects and we help growing businesses claim their rightful market share online.
So if this is a problem that you would like to fix, we can do that in the next 30 days or less. We sit down with you, we unpack your business and we put together a strategic plan that problem solves what gaps you face right now, helps you generate new and repeat business on autopilot. If that's something that you're interested in, all you got to do is go to our website, which is www.thomascreative.com.
boardroom. So we've got a special guest by the name of Chris Jackson. He is a friend of mine and a very successful coach in Australia. He specializes in the areas of leadership systems and team development. His uniqueness is creating personalized plans that encompass a holistic view to the human individual, the CEO, right down to the inner workings of the mind and its functionality. He's working with high profile business leaders, founders and CEOs and he's just an all round legend of a guy. So I am grateful to have you here, Chris.
[00:02:28] Speaker C: Jared, thank you so much for having me. It's awesome to be here, chatting with you and hanging out, having an amazing conversation, all the stuff that we like to geek out on.
[00:02:36] Speaker B: Yeah, it's awesome, mate. We've got a lot to share today and for the, for the listeners tuning in, I'm sure there's a lot to learn from your story and your journey as a coach slash entrepreneur, now a family man as well. Chris.
[00:02:50] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. There's been a lot of amazing things that have happened in my life. I'm very, very blessed. It's been an amazing journey and I know you're been on, on that journey with me for many, many years. So thanks again for, for all the help over the years, Jared, with all the branding and marketing campaigns and Facebook ads. We've, we've done some great work together. So thanks again.
[00:03:07] Speaker B: That's awesome, mate. So for, for all the listeners that are tuning in right now, Chris Jackson, give us the lowdown. The story of, of the man behind the coach. Yeah, I'd love to hear it all, mate.
[00:03:18] Speaker C: Yeah, well, I, I guess the, the big catalyst for how I got into coaching in the first place was I actually had a, a massive breakup with my ex girlfriend in Brazil. And the fallout from that relationship landed me in some pretty hot water. We had some pretty. In the aftermath of that breakup, my girlfriend told me some things about myself that I, that I'd overlooked. She gave me some slate. She basically gave me some really, really confronting feedback. I thought I was a really great friend and a great partner. Turns out I wasn't.
And I did some soul searching. When she shared that with me, I really looked inward and went on this journey of self discovery. I did, I went, started going to seminars, I started going to workshops, I started reading self help books. I started doing all this deep inner work because I realized that I had some really big blind spots. I had some real, some, some dark shadows, some unconscious parts of me that I didn't really know were there and they were playing out in some kind of toxic way. So I did a lot of work on myself and that led me down the pathway of lots of seminars, like Tony Robbins seminars and all that kind of thing. And then eventually I, I stumbled across originally life coaching, which then evolved into I studied, I studied a lot life coaching course. One of these courses that pops up on Facebook. I studied it in the life coaching course. I, I jumped on a sales call and spent $5,000. And then there we go, life coaching.
I didn't even know what life coaching was, but I just thought I'd do it. I flew to Melbourne for the first three days and then after three days I realized, wow, this is exactly what I've been looking for.
So it started out life coaching. Then I extended my training into business coaching. Then it was leadership coaching. And I've just then been amassing training after training over the last 10 years. Everything from psychotherapy, psychology, leadership, you name it, all different training. So I've just been, yeah, it's been the last decade since I left my career in engineering. At the time I just walked away from a decade long engineering career to follow my, my heart, to follow my, my path which turned out to be coaching. So that's a, in a, in a, very, kind of, in a bit of a snapshot. That's the, the long, that's the short version of a very long journey.
[00:05:36] Speaker B: Well, there's a lot in that, mate. And you know, you and I have had many conversations about the, the journey you've been on and how it all started for you as a coach, as you said 10 years ago. But I suppose for everyone that is listening right now, you know, when one thing that always got, one thing that always stood out for me is you were working in the minds and you were an engineer and obviously paid quite a lot of money as an engineer as well. You know, starting out as a coach and transitioning from that engineering role that you had and becoming a life coach. I'm interested and I'm sure everyone else is interested. How was that transition for you and what was that process like for you?
[00:06:20] Speaker C: It was brutal.
It was. I mean I basically, I, I think I must have been studying coaching for maybe a year once when I decided to leave my engineering job and, and yeah, I was doing engineering for the best part of a decade. I studied engineering at university. So engineering was in my DNA and that I was also, what was also in my DNA was the mindset of a worker. You know, just someone, it's kind of time for money. It's like, great, just tell me what to do and I'll do it. Yeah, I'm very, very good at what I, what I was doing, but very much, you know, kind of limited thinking. So when I entered the world of entrepreneurship and business it was, oh my lord, did I suck hard.
I had no idea what I was doing, but I was ballsy and I was really bold. I basically left my job and thought, look, let's just go for it. I've got enough money in assets and real estate to kind of last me at least a couple of years. So worst case, if I, if I really suck hard and fail, I can always go back and get my job back. It's kind of my thinking behind it. But yeah, it was, it was a rough transition. There were so many things that I didn't know, so many moments of despair, any crisis of like not having a clue what I was doing. Didn't really have any awareness about around branding or marketing or even sales, but definitely had a ton of passion and a lot of heart and just poured my heart and soul into it. So that's kind of what got me through. It's just the pure, pure passion.
And then I started to learn, you know, more nuanced dimensions of marketing and branding and all the kind of stuff that you know, that you've spoken about over the years. But until that happened, it was, was a really hit and miss ride. It was kind of like clients would come, clients would go, income was up, income was down, without really any broader understanding of entrepreneurship or strategy. So it was kind of winging it for the first two or three years. And then I started to wake up to, oh, there's actually more to it.
[00:08:20] Speaker B: It's interesting, isn't it? Like, I mean, I'm sure all of us can relate to that. You know, that transition into the world of business is not an easy one, is it? And you just outlined how challenging it was for, for you. So, so well done first and foremost, man. That's a testament to you and your, your passion as you call it. But I suppose just to deep unravel that even a bit further, you know, can you explain and go into an example as to what was really the, the challenge that you're facing as you're transitioning? What was that pain that you're going through?
[00:08:54] Speaker C: I would say it is not really understanding some pretty fundamental domains of business. Like I'd say for the biggest thing I was lacking was really, I think it was probably sales. Understanding how sales is actually service and understanding how it's not, it's not sleazy or awkward, it's not manipulative. That's kind of the initial interpretation or limiting beliefs I had around sales at the time was like selling myself is sleazy.
That's probably the biggest limitation I had. Whereas I now love sales. Like I really, really. That's been a big transformational shift.
I love, like I love selling. And it's not necessarily, I don't necessarily see it as trying to sell something to get something. I being very, very service orientated in how I communicate and just getting to the root cause of what's going on for someone really, really quickly so I can help them or at least point in the direction of how to get them help. So that was the thing I was missing. I didn't really see the link there of service and says that the foundation of sales is service and caring about people.
So that was probably the biggest thing that I was missing. But I guess also just an overall lack of, you might say now that I'm in business for over 10 years.
I consider myself. My identity is, I am an entrepreneur now. At the beginning, I didn't see myself as an entrepreneur. I, like, I was still stuck, ingrained in that worker mentality.
It was still about, okay, I need to do my 40 hours a week.
What have I done? Is my, is my calendar full? That kind of. What, what are the, what are the major metrics that I'm looking to drive here? What's the, what's the major strategic output that I'm looking to implement? So I didn't really have that kind of big picture understanding of business at the time. So that was a big thing that was missing as well. That makes sense.
[00:10:48] Speaker B: It does, it does. And you know, I couldn't fully understand the. And we'll go into the mindset of, of, of an entrepreneur against the mindset of an employee. And there's a huge contrast between the two, isn't there? And I, I suppose I can relate that to even my, my, my, my story coming into the world of entrepreneurship. I was, I was actually 27 at the time and, and like yourself, probably a little bit, you know, searching for answers, not knowing exactly where to go, what to do. And then my dad, who was a business person, said, son, you gotta read this book. Just read it. It'll help you understand. And I never really took it seriously until one day I was lying on the bed and I'm sitting there and I'm like, what the hell am I doing with my life? I come back from London, I was, you know, in music over there, and I thought I had it all right. Then when I was lying there in the bed, I saw this book. Rich dad, Poor dad, the bible of wealth creation, if you want to call it that. And that, that, that pivotal moment for me is literally understanding my mindset as an employee thinking like that. Because I used to run restaurants. I used to, Used to, yeah, for many years, running restaurants and running events and things like that. So my mindset, probably similar to yours, Chris, was stuck in that employee type of approach. Whereas time for money x amount of hours equals this amount of money in return, what's my highest salary I can achieve by doing this amount of hours and so on. If I quite, if I climb the corporate ladder. So I can fully relate to that pain, that transitional period. And like, you took me many, many. Well, it took me several years to really crack that until like, you had the passion to say, f this, I'm gonna do it. I'm gonna go all in. I don't know what I'm doing, but I'm gonna do it anyway.
[00:12:31] Speaker C: So.
[00:12:32] Speaker B: Yeah, and, and, and so where for you now, Chris, when you've been through that, what was say the moment that you're like, okay, I'm starting to get this now. Like, I'm starting to feel like I'm the person that I want to be or the entrepreneur that I believe I can be. When was that sort of shift?
[00:12:50] Speaker C: I feel like probably the most notable moment where I really felt that was when I actually was coming back from a Tony Robbins retreat in Fiji and I was actually sitting next to one of the participants on the plane on the ride home and he was actually the CFO of Mercedes Benz in Australia. And, and I, I was literally just chatting with him, like I'm chatting to you now, and found out that my, my accommodation, my mate in Melbourne that I was supposed to be staying with because I was about to do a seven day NLP training in Melbourne, he'd actually forgot to leave the key out for me. So I was not going to have anywhere to stay in Melbourne for a week.
I hit this guy up, Peter Kenzora was his name. I hit Peter, I said, pete, I actually don't have anywhere to stay in Melbourne. Can I stay with you?
Pretty ballsy legend, but we're kind of Tony Robbins family, so he's like, of course, stay as long as you want. Anyway, so the rest of the plan, ride back from vg, we're getting to know each other quite well. Anyway, I stay at his house for the next week. While I'm doing this training, I'm sharing with him all the techniques that I'm learning, I'm coaching him, I'm helping with his leadership, I'm helping him with any of the conflicts that he's got, stuff like that. And, and even the phone behind me is agreeing with me there that that was a sign from God that this, it was all meant to be. And anyway, at the end of the week of chatting with, with Pete, he says to me, he says, chris, I really want you to work with my team. I really want you to work with me. I want you to work with our whole entire organization because there's something here that you have to share with us because what you've done with me has just been absolutely profound.
[00:14:27] Speaker B: Wow.
[00:14:28] Speaker C: I'm like, whoa. And it was at that moment where I was like, I'm literally being asked by the CFO of Mercedes to work with them. Like, that's amazing. And I was in disbelief because the whole time I wasn't, I wasn't trying to do that. I wasn't trying to get that. It just, for me, just showing up, being sincere and just helping. And then I'm sitting across the table with him and the HR manager and we're talking, we're just mapping out a contract, you know, for thousands of thousands of dollars. And so at that point, it really sunk in, like, wow, like what I'm actually doing is actually legit. I'm actually, I've kind of hit the big time. Yeah. To that point, I kind of knew that what I, what I knew was powerful, but I hadn't got that validation. So I feel like that point when I was like, wow, okay, I've now got that recognition, that acknowledgement. Okay, I, I can now. I, I'm now believing what I'm doing.
[00:15:23] Speaker B: Yeah. It's like the mindset's like, I can do this now. All right, you got this, buddy. You got this.
[00:15:27] Speaker C: Yeah. Yeah. It's wild how I relied on that external validation, but that was the moment. That was when it all kind of. It really, really landed like, okay, yeah, I'm legit now. I can feel legit.
[00:15:39] Speaker B: That's an amazing story and I remember you sharing that with me many years ago when I first met you. For everyone that's listening in, I first met Chris 2017. It was Chris, and we got to know each other through. Introduced by a good friend of ours by name of Brock Bowen. Good legend of a dude. And anyway, he connected us up and then you came and stay at the coast with me for a coup couple of days. We got to know each other and learn a lot about you and the way that you think and the way that you do things. And one thing that always stuck out for me, Chris, and this is to. To your testament, is and you talk about engineering, but I think on some level being that I sort of think a little bit like you on an engineering type of level where, you know, there's the mechanical aspect of knowing how to program and re engineer things from the end result backwards and things like that. So I get that type of thinking. And one thing I really get got from you that I picked up very quickly was you're very, very strategic with knowing how to plan systems and sort of build a foundation with your clients to sort of program where they're going to get to and knowing how to do it. And I thought that was very valuable. And I, as I said, I picked it up at a very, very early stage. After talking to you, I'm like, yeah, this guy, this guy is unique. He's got a special skill here that I feel a lot of coaches lack. And a lot of coaches sort of typically go in with this, and I don't mean this in a negative way, but that sort of fluffy approach. Whereas you have a systems based mindset and knowing how to help people achieve what they want to achieve by laying not only their mindset and going into the psyche of a human individual, but also knowing how to program it and systemize it so that it's easy for them to follow. And I really picked that up. So, mate, for people that are tuning in right now, how do you go about in creating systems for. For your clients? So walk us through the process.
[00:17:27] Speaker C: Yeah, thanks for acknowledging that, mate. It certainly is. One of the unique things about what I do is in one conversation with a client, we can literally be having a spreadsheet open, looking at what are their KPIs or what are their metrics that they're looking to achieve in their business. And then literally the next conversation, we're having a conversation around one of their earliest memories as a child where they felt worthless or they got rejected and how that's playing out in their leadership and how they're not able to receive or receive.
So, yeah, that's kind of one of the layers that goes across all the systems that I help clients create is a deep understanding of the big picture, what are they creating, all the way down to how their own psychology is playing out in that.
So I guess my superpower, if you like, is I've got the ability to go really, really wide. But also deep in one conversation, they go literally go from mapping out someone's vision and then as soon as the. As soon as we hit that moment where we know that someone's vision is compromised by some part of themselves that has a limiting belief or a fear. We can now go straight into that to unpick that and then you might say dissolve that to then come back out to the bigger picture to give them a greater vision, to kind of leave that back to systems. I always say that the systems that an entrepreneur is using is just a manifestation of what's happening inside of them. Right. It's literally the systems that someone finds themselves in. And they might not even be aware that they have a system, but everyone has systems. They're just unconscious. Most people have default unconscious systems that they use ranging from everyone has a system for what happens when they wake up in the morning, do they roll over and check their phone or do they wake up and do they put their running shoes on? Everyone has a system for what they do. And so my approach is we, we start with a bigger picture. We, we get clear on what's, what's their vision, what is their ultimate strategy. And then we start to look at okay, how is their inner game or their mindset getting in the way of them manifesting their vision, implementing their strategy. And then we start going to work on okay, right, let's, let's fine tune everything in a business. Everything from their hiring all the way through, all the way down to how do they have one to ones with their, with their team. How do you talk to your team? How do you give feedback to your team? So it's, it's, it, it really is a matter of looking at every individual client and helping them fine tune their own systems. Because not, there's not a one system fits everyone approach. It just doesn't work that way. I've got some clients who, having too many systems can actually be counter productive for them. So what is the, what's the, what's the, you might say, what's the minimum effective dose of systems that someone needs to thrive? Because if you go overboard on systems, it can create overwhelm, but if you don't have systems, it creates chaos.
[00:20:13] Speaker B: It's finding that balance.
[00:20:15] Speaker C: Absolutely, absolutely. So it's really finding out what is the balance, what is the system that someone's currently on, is it working, is it not working? And then we go to work on refining it, expanding it or tweaking it. And it's really about they go away and test it and I hold them accountable to that and they go and test the system and then we come back and refine it. So there's a whole process that I take my clients through around really refining their systems and it's a case by case.
[00:20:41] Speaker B: It's fantastic.
[00:20:42] Speaker D: It sounds like there's been, you know, quite an evolution of the people that you worked with in the journey that you've been on. And now obviously with a focus on leadership.
What is it, is it about leadership that kind of stands out to you that like is most rewarding would you say, compared to, I guess in other places where you've worked?
[00:21:00] Speaker C: I would say the most rewarding thing that I get to do around leadership here with my clients is really helping them thrive, like understanding how, how they can actually thrive and take owners.
I'd say probably one of the biggest downfalls that I notice in most of the clients that I work with is like a helplessness or a hopelessness around not being able to get the best out of others.
They come to me struggling, saying, I just wish my team could do what I want them to do.
And there's a hopelessness there, there's a despair, there's almost like, oh, like, like why can't they just do what I asked them to do?
It's really recording. When I can help them realize there's a way to communicate with every single one of their team members. There's a system they can put in place that gets their team to, to commit. There's a way that they can communicate, there's a way they can be as a leader that gets the best out of their people and that allows them to connect with them. And that's one of the biggest things that's missing with CEOs and leaders is they have this. They're really, really good technically. In fact, many of them are technically brilliant, but they lack the softer skills to be able to connect on an emotional level, to understand that someone actually needs to thrive. So instead of cracking the whip sometimes, a lot of the time what is needed is actually a deeper understanding, like a deeper listening, a better listener. Like, that's a lot of times CEOs are not that they're not even realize that listening is actually one of the skills that's the biggest skill that they're missing because they're not understanding their team, they're not understanding what's, what's not happening. So that's really rewarding for me when I can help someone really tap into that powerful, you might say, more compassionate style of leadership.
That is the bold whip cracking style that they're, they're used to, that hasn't been getting the results that they want. That ends up being with conflict and fights and employees leaving and they find a better way and it's really liberating for them and it's really, really, it's really, really inspiring when they actually realize they can have great, great team members that actually get the job done so that they can have more time off.
[00:23:07] Speaker B: That's amazing.
So, Jaz, you can, you want to go.
[00:23:12] Speaker D: Sorry, Yeah, I was going to say. So working with, working with coaches and leaders, do you find that like the ego comes into play there, especially in, I guess, in high leadership roles? And what's that process like when you're trying to, you know, break through that?
[00:23:31] Speaker C: You mean like working with them, helping them to, to help them see their own ego, that kind of thing? Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Well, I mean, it comes up very regularly and I've Got a very good, very, you might say very harmonious way of working with clients, where I create a very, very safe space for. For my clients to lovingly tell on themselves. Right?
I encourage all my clients to realize that, okay, it's okay that you're not perfect. That's the. No one's perfect. And the reason why you're here is because you want to get better results. So the more honest you can be with me, the better I help you. So let's just. So I get them to. I get them to go away and write down a list of what are all of their challenges? What are all the things that are showing up in their life? And they come back with pages and pages of stuff. And I say, okay, now tell me, if you were the one that was responsible for creating all of this, how might that be?
[00:24:20] Speaker B: Right?
[00:24:20] Speaker C: So I get them to take on the role of, okay, you've created this, right? Not in a judgmental way, but in a loving way. Let's just say. Okay, let's just say you're the one responsible. You're the CEO. This has happened under your watch. Tell me how you created all of this, and then that's. We get them to take responsibility for, oh, okay. If I'm the creator of this, how I created, okay, well, I recruited the wrong person, or I didn't ask the right questions in the interview, or, oh, I'm missing a system for that, or I got angry and I got frustrated and I yelled at my team member or I yelled at a client, Right? So I get. Once they take responsibility for themselves, they can now start to see that they're inner parts of themselves that are in conflict like that. They see that. They see that there's an aspect of themselves that's not optimized, that's not harmonious, that is not the best version of themselves. So they start to see that more and more. And then I can help them be more specific about what are the. How is that playing out? What's that pattern? Why does that happen? Right? Why does that continue to happen?
So it very quickly illuminates, you might say, all the unresourceful patterns that are playing out, that are typically unconscious, that are the default programmings of a CEO. And once we've elicited that, we can get to work on repatterning that and reprogramming. So once they see that, they become quite enthusiastic.
Once we say, I see that now, what do we do about that? And I go, great, let's have a conversation around that.
[00:25:43] Speaker B: Essentially, Chris what you're really doing there is, you're unconsciously helping them become aware of themselves and their own challenges that they're facing. And, and having the aha moment, I guess, am I correct there?
[00:25:58] Speaker C: It's, it's them having the aha moment that they are the bottleneck, they are the cause. Now admittedly, yes, there are other causes, right? Particularly in business where there's teams and clients and there's, there's a whole lot of other stakeholders and people involved. But that's the first aha moment that my clients have, is that they are the creator. They are the co creator of everything that's happening under their watch. And as soon as they get that responsibility kicks in. And instead of that hopelessness or that despair, it now becomes curiosity. Okay, how am I creating that? How am I creating team members that are not doing what I'm asking them to do? Like how, how am I somehow playing a part in that? So it creates responsibility, it creates empowerment, it creates curiosity. And when we, when we get to curiosity, the conversations start to get really, really fun because my clients now come to me and say, Chris, can you, can you help me understand how did I create this this time? Right? So it starts to get, it starts to get more light hearted.
And I would say, I'd say my clients really start to lean in and they take more and more and more responsibility as the author and as the creator. But ultimately the aha moment is that my clients realize they are the bottleneck, they are the cause.
[00:27:13] Speaker B: That's, that's really a remarkable skill to have that as well. And that's not always easy to do is helping, helping unpack that aha moment. Because that's the first step, isn't it, Chris? The first step to, to, to, to change and transformation is, is having that awareness, isn't it? And, and from there that awareness becomes how do I problem solve this? And that's, becomes that. That, that's the journey they start going on. And we've all been there, haven't we, really?
It's just a matter of time, I guess to an individual has that light bulb moment that they have, it's quite profound, mate. It's quite profound. And that's, that's, I guess from my perspective here, is that what separates a really, truly as opposed to the more amateur style, fluffy coach I like to call them.
And yeah, it's, it's remarkable, mate. So just getting into your business now and everyone that's tuning in, you and I were talking the other day about this idea that you've got regarding the, the inner game guy or this thing that you're sort of leaning in towards, do you want to share your ideas as to what that idea that you've got that's brewing up inside of you? Explain a bit more about that, where it's coming.
[00:28:24] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. So the next evolution of really what I'm creating the world here is it's really CEO in a game, I call it. And it's really helping CEOs realize that aha moment that they are the catalyst, they are the cause, they have far more power than they realize.
So it's really giving CEOs the tools at both the mindset level, but also at the strategic level. And to see both of those things going hand in hand and helping them understand that they can have the business that they want, but they need to understand that, yeah, they've got to have the leadership, they've got to have the team and they've got to have the systems so that without those three domains that they will not have a business that operates without their constant supervision. So that's just with every business side I've worked with, that's the common denominator. Those three dimensions are necessary to have a self sustaining, thriving business. And most business owners that get to seven figures, they've got there from hustle and a lot of hard work. And then in order to go from seven to eight figures, they've got to get much, much smarter about it because there's no more hours in the day, they're going to burn themselves out to try and push that even further. So they've got to get, they've got to replicate themselves and their own leadership style in the business.
They've got to help their team be empowered to also step up and lead. So they've got to create leaders in their own business. They have to have the right team on board, not just the right people in terms of recruiting, but they've got to understand that they need to train them, they need to mentor them, in some cases, they need coaching, they need to take them away and have retreats and all sorts of development work to get them up to scratch so they can run the business on their behalf. And ultimately they need the right systems. So when they have the right systems, there's the repeatability, there's the predictability in a business because it runs like clockwork. So, so that's the CEO in a game aspect is looking at, okay, what's the, what's the business owner's relationship with themselves, with others and with their business. Like that means that they, they have the business that they want or not. So it's really looking about what did their, what's their internal relationship like? So, and that might sound funny for a lot of people, like my relationship with myself. Absolutely. Someone's relationship, relation with herself is like, okay, what's your relationship like with money? What's your relationship like with letting go of control? What's your relationship like with saying no to things that you don't quite align with? Right. So for example, some people, some people find it difficult to say no.
Some people find it really difficult to ask for money. So again, it's these internal relationships that are the cause of everything. So yeah, see our inner game is all about helping someone become acutely self aware about all their programs and all their patterns and all their behavior play out so that they can design the leadership, the team and the systems that has that self sustaining business.
[00:31:14] Speaker B: One thing I'll say here is, I'll just jump in is you and I, Chris, about probably seven, when we first met, seven, eight years ago, we joined a men's work style leadership program. That was quite unique, wasn't it? And you can elaborate on this in more detail. But where I personally found a lot of value is becoming grounded and learning to be more aware of myself. And I found that program that we both went through was good for a number of reasons, but it was purely men's only program.
And I've witnessed you and your evolution as a coach and a human being from that journey becoming more conscious as a coach. Do you want to share for everyone that's listening a bit about the, the, the, the men's program that we're in and how it influenced you and your journey today?
[00:32:18] Speaker C: Yeah, it was a powerful leadership training that we went through.
It was five years worth of, worth of training and deep, deep inner work. It was a circle format. So it's a sharing circle, sharing space, which are for those that don't know. Sharing spaces are incredibly vulnerable, courageous spaces where your deepest, darkest secrets that perhaps you haven't shared anyone share with anyone in your life, even your best friend or your partner come out and they get transmuted, they get dealt with, they get acknowledged and they get resolved.
So yeah, that's, that was an incredibly powerful space. But all those things that need to come up can come up and it's, I guess the, the key element there that allows for that is community. It's, it's actually being in live conversations with other people where you feel safe and you feel Supported to talk about stuff that normally gets shoved under the carpet, that gets hidden away. And, and yeah, I, I mean, me and you and all the men in that group, you know, we grew so much. And that's one of the things I've come to realize is, is so important. And it's what I infuse in as many of the group programs as I can, is that element of vulnerable sharing, the business owners realizing it's okay. In fact, not only is it okay, it's essential to be able to have someone to talk to about this stuff. Not just business stuff, but relationship stuff, health stuff, financial stuff, all the things, all the things in life that need to come out because it's all related. We don't, we don't just live in the world of business.
Our relationship with our spouse affects our business life. Our relationship with our kids affects our health. Everything is interrelated, interdependent. So that's one of the things that I'm really passionate about, is really seeing the holistic approach to the entrepreneur and the business owner and leaving no stone unturned and really supporting deep, deep conversations for it to all come out and for it to all be transmuted and you might say, resolved. Yeah. Incredibly, incredibly powerful work that we did.
[00:34:21] Speaker B: Very, very profound work. It was, wasn't it? And, you know, moving on to a broader picture question here. So being that, you know, we both come from a coaching background, we both did a lot of training in personal development and coaching, nlp, you know, myself in more Zen meditation, yourself in many different facets that you've done further training onwards.
How have you found from your personal perspective the coaching industry as a whole in the last, say, five years or even to present day, what's your perspective and take on it as it is?
[00:34:59] Speaker C: Yeah, okay, so good question.
My perspective is that really what makes good coaching now in the year 2025 is someone who's actually had lived experience in a particular domain.
I feel like there is a lot of coach trainings out there now, even free coach trainings that like, like this. It's, it's really easy to get a coaching certification. And I don't personally feel like certifications really mean much.
What really matters is that someone has actually had an embodied, lived experience of living and working through that which they're helping their clients to work through.
And that's the strongest place to be coaching from.
There's plenty of coaches now that just go away and look up something on ChatGPT and say, okay, cool, go do this. But to actually Be live with someone in the moment, really using your own wisdom and your own lived experience. That's where the value is now in coaching, I feel so, yeah, very, very easy to find a coach who's done a certification. Not so easy to find a coach who's actually been through the trenches and who's actually lived through what someone else is going through and come out the other side to lead them through that.
So that's, that's probably my, my take on the industry.
I guess I'd also say that what's also really, really important is the creating the connection and the safety for a client to really, really feel like they can open up and share like deeply like safety. Because without that. I've worked with clients before and I've made the mistake myself of working with clients, but I haven't created that safety. And so we could only go so far together because they didn't really want to tell me things. They were holding back things. So clients ever holding something back. Yeah. That means that you can only extract so much value, but as soon as you open up that vulnerability that they feel safe, then you can work with absolutely everything in their life and you can make their life 100, 100,000 times better because you now, they're now being honest, they're now being sincere and they're now open. So that's, that's what I've noticed is some of the most important things.
[00:37:12] Speaker B: Amazing.
[00:37:13] Speaker D: And where do you see the, do you see the industry changing at all over the coming years? I guess, you know, with emerging technology, technologies, AI, et cetera, do you think this space will change or you think it'll remain the same? So obviously you can't, you can't AI connection. But yeah. What are your thoughts there?
[00:37:30] Speaker C: Yeah, I feel like AI is going to profoundly change the way that the business strategy side of things works. I feel like the technology is already getting so good that strategy, the strategy side of things is going to be complemented a lot more, but I don't think it's gonna, I don't think coaches and consultants are going to be completely replaced, but I feel like clients are going to be do a lot. They're going to be able to do a lot of self coaching and a lot of self strategizing, which means they can do a lot of. The bar gets raised across the board, but now makes our work far more nuanced. So what does is like for example, clients will get as far as they can with say, ChatGpt, but then they realize, oh, I've got A fear. I've got a block, I can't get rid of that on my own. I need to go and see someone around that.
[00:38:14] Speaker D: So it's leveraging those kind of technologies in some ways.
[00:38:17] Speaker C: Yeah. I mean, I feel like it's. If anything, AI simply makes our clients smarter and it gives them more resources for them to come back to us and have much more conversations. Yeah. So like, I'm a big fan of giving my clients prompts to go away and do a lot of the deeper work on themselves and get as far as they can get. And then when they get stuck, then they come to me, then we can do much more valuable work. Right. That can't be replaced. As you said, connection can't be replaced by AI. So a lot of the deeper, transformative conversations have with clients. It's, it's really when we, when we, when you meet a client in that space, at their emotion, in their state of being, that's where you can guide them through the inner workings of their own mind and help them have those insights. Those aha moments, those epiphanies and those sometimes breakthrough moments where tears or laughter or real deep emotions get released is, is the big aha moments that chat GBT is not going to give them. Big, big aha moments in that moment because there's kind of human connection and emotion that's, that's got to come together to get the alchemical process.
[00:39:24] Speaker B: That's awesome. I have a question for you in regards to the, the business again, I suppose everyone listening in. You know, there are many, many coaches out there doing many, many things, running sales funnels, you know, running email marketing campaigns and, and integration of AI and things like that. But what, what would you say for you, Chris Jackson has been the winning formula to achieve your business success, especially in the last, say, two years?
[00:39:53] Speaker C: I would say my knowing and recognition and ongoing commitment to, to really seeing that business is all about relationships, it's all about people. Like at the end of the, it's always going to be dealing with a person. Always.
There's always going to be tool, there's going to be funnels, there's going to be technology. But at the end of the day, there's always a person.
So really recognizing that, I feel like is really, really pivotal. And I've always prioritized seeing that human, seeing that person as someone who, if, if possible, I'm wanting to do the best that I can so that on, on that moment when they're on their deathbed and they have their last few thoughts that I perhaps might be one of those ones that they think of and saying, I'm really glad that Chris came into my life and helped me. Right? That's kind of what I'm shooting for, is like being able to help someone to such degree in their life that it's one of those little flash memories that comes up in their life thinking, oh, my God, thank you. Thank you. So really caring about someone, like, at a deeper level, not seeing them as just a dollar or a sale, but really seeing it as this is actual human being that I'm helping, having that core philosophy of what I do, always I want to do the highest good by them and willing to serve them, especially in the face of criticism. Especially in the face of other people, you know, judging, criticizing. You know, we live in that kind of world, right? Where you put a post out there, you might have half people agree with that, half people hate you for it.
They're being willing to be of service, especially when you don't get anything back from. In a lot of cases. That makes sense.
[00:41:26] Speaker B: It does, mate. It does. So I have a question for you for founders, CEOs and or coaches, leaders and so on that are listening, and they want to know more about Chris Jackson. I have a question for you. What question can you help them learn or understand that will help them in their journey in business right now? What is the question that you can help them with?
[00:41:54] Speaker C: The question I can help them answer is, how are they causing.
How are they causing or creating the business that they currently got? That's not what they want?
All right, so how. How are they responsible for the way that things are right now that isn't what they want?
And then understanding that very, very. In a very nuanced way, in a very deep way that is also very practical around, okay, how do I. How do I now become that version of me that now has the business that shows up in the way that I want it? And for many business owners, they've got a business that's doing very well. Like, most of my clients are doing seven figures on the way to eight figures.
But the way that they're living and the way that they're running their business is not sustainable, okay?
It's inefficient. They just can't keep doing it. They'll burn out. And they're just. Just not practical. So that I'd say another question that I can help them answer is, okay, not only what needs to change inside me first, but what needs to change outside me to make this more sustainable?
[00:42:57] Speaker B: Fantastic. Well, you heard it from, from Chris. Guys, it's been very valuable lesson here today.
So mate, for everyone that is listening, where can they find you? Share some information about how they can get in touch should they want to.
[00:43:13] Speaker C: Yeah, ChrisJacksonCoaching.com would be the place. Drop me a.
Drop me, just hit the contact on the website or ChrisChrisJacksonCoaching.com just send me an email and love to connect with anyone who is in that position where they know that there's something inside and they want to, they would like to work on that's going to help them on the outside, the inside out approach as I call it. So yeah, they're probably the easiest ways to get a hold of them.
[00:43:40] Speaker B: Great. And you offer a. I believe from my understanding and what you've mentioned to me in the past, you offer like a discovery session that can help them. It's, it's, there's no obligation, things like that.
[00:43:49] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah, it's, I'd say it's, it's more than a discovery session. It's helping them have a complete diagnostic understanding of their vision, their strategy, their mindset, everything that's holding them back. So they get a complete, you might say, yeah, let's call it, let's call it a diagnostic. That's probably the best way to describe it so they understand exactly what's needed. And then from there, if it makes sense to work together, we put together a customized proposal to give them exactly what they want in a particular time frame, depending on how quickly they're looking to get results. Yeah, awesome.
[00:44:21] Speaker B: Well guys, thank you for tuning in today. It's been really insightful, you know, sitting here with Chris. As you guys know, I've mentioned this, Chris and I go way back and, and I personally am hearing new information today that I'm personally learning as well. I'm sure you are too, Jared, the other Jared.
So, yeah, so thank you for being here, Chris. I really appreciate it, mate.
[00:44:42] Speaker C: Yeah, awesome chatting with you guys. Thanks so much. It's been fun.
[00:44:45] Speaker B: Awesome.
Yeah. Anything else to share, Jared?
[00:44:49] Speaker D: I just want to thank Chris. It was great to chat. You shared so many valuable things, especially about, you know, how curiosity opens up so much. But yeah, no thanks, Chris. It's been, it's been great to chat.
[00:45:00] Speaker B: Right guys? And for you, for those of you listening to us, where the brand up in podcast, if you want to get in touch with us in regards to helping you unpack your business and you're looking to create a master plan for growth, we can like Chris said, Diagnose exactly what is happening in the business right now from a marketing perspective. Very different to what Chris is doing. But we can diagnose exactly what your marketing efforts look like and figure out why you're not achieving the customers that you want and how we can help you bridge that gap so you can improve on that marketing system. So if you want to have a look at that, all you got to go to is our website, www.thomascreative.com forward/boardroom. Until then, guys, have a fantastic day and we look forward to seeing you all very soon.
[00:45:51] Speaker A: You've been listening to the Brand Alchemy podcast with your hosts Jared Asher and Jared Break. For more information or to request your spot as a guest speaker, go to www.timelesscreative.com.
